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Nov 19, 2012
11/12
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and that's actually very important for speaker boehner because despite the loss that paul ryan had on a national level, he still has a considerable amount of clout within the house republican conference where a lot of folks will look towards where ryan goes. if ryan votes yes, that gives them enough cover to vote yes on a deal. >> the republican house conference seems to be operating in an alternative universe because mr. ryan told abc that the president didn't have a mandate. rather, he and his house gap gop have one. he said i think the ideas we talked about, i think they're popular ideas. did the election not happen? >> when they say they're popular ideas, they believe that -- >> that the electorate dismissed them and did not vote for them. >> but they believe that the issue of the debt is still one that they're very strong on, that people do not like to have the $16 trillion debt, that their policies are the best moving forward. but, look, martin, if anything else what you are seeing here is a very smart political ploy by speaker boehner trying not to allow what happened in august
and that's actually very important for speaker boehner because despite the loss that paul ryan had on a national level, he still has a considerable amount of clout within the house republican conference where a lot of folks will look towards where ryan goes. if ryan votes yes, that gives them enough cover to vote yes on a deal. >> the republican house conference seems to be operating in an alternative universe because mr. ryan told abc that the president didn't have a mandate. rather, he...
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Nov 16, 2012
11/12
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MSNBC
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as for speaker boehner i know they would personally like to make this time of deal. assuming the grand bargain happens, you can't get it done in a lame duck session, at least you move forward there, grand bargain, is this something that safbs the u.s. from this debt we've inflicted on ourselves for so long, where people stand up and notice it or would there still be the naysayers out there that say it still is not enough. what do you think? >> i think a true grand bargain would be a really great confidence signal to markets. now i don't think it's the solution for our short term growth problems because right now borrowing is cheap and we don't have a debt problem dragging on our economy right now but if we're looking at freeing up investment, freeing up hiring over the medium and long terms, absolutely the markets would love that. >> i think, also, the biggest negative domestically generated is the perpetual fights of brinksmanship, government shutdown, debt ceiling. a grand bargain that if it did nothing else put off those types of fights for the foreseeable future
as for speaker boehner i know they would personally like to make this time of deal. assuming the grand bargain happens, you can't get it done in a lame duck session, at least you move forward there, grand bargain, is this something that safbs the u.s. from this debt we've inflicted on ourselves for so long, where people stand up and notice it or would there still be the naysayers out there that say it still is not enough. what do you think? >> i think a true grand bargain would be a...
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Nov 13, 2012
11/12
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CURRENT
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>> now boehner we're back to where we were before the election in some respects. there is a significant core of the republican party that simply will not raise taxes under any sixths. they will not raise rates. they still feel that they are pledged to grover norquist, maybe not to the american people. not to the constitution, but to grover norquist. therefore they're not going to go along--even if boehner wants them to go along. both sides the president and democrats on one side, boehner and the republicans are basically maneuvering for bargaining position for what is going to be a long-term negotiation. >> eliot: they're just shadow boxing, i think that's exactly right. i wonder and i'm trying to assess--i have no knowledge of what goes on inside the republican party but i'm trying to discern if boehner has more strength now than he did when this negotiation took place lose yearlastyear. does he have the political strength because his party lost, can he look eric cantor in the eye and other republican leaders in the eye and say we have no choice but to cut a deal
>> now boehner we're back to where we were before the election in some respects. there is a significant core of the republican party that simply will not raise taxes under any sixths. they will not raise rates. they still feel that they are pledged to grover norquist, maybe not to the american people. not to the constitution, but to grover norquist. therefore they're not going to go along--even if boehner wants them to go along. both sides the president and democrats on one side, boehner...
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Nov 15, 2012
11/12
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next, i love the '90s and why boehner and the boys should, too. stay with us. >> several states want to secede from the united states. >> leave the union. >> because 69 results of the election. it's so strange because i had many of those states on a list of states i would like to secede from the united states. i had proposed a bill to the congress. ♪ ♪ [ female announcer ] pop in a whole new kind of clean. with tide pods. a powerful three-in-one detergent that cleans. brightens. and fights stains just one removes more stains than the 6 next leading pacs combined pop in. stand out. without freshly-made pasta. you could also cut corners by making it without 100% real cheddar cheese. but then...it wouldn't be stouffer's mac & cheese. just one of over 70 satisfying recipes for one from stouffer's. constipated? yeah. mm. some laxatives like dulcolax can cause cramps. but phillips' caplets don't. they have magnesium. for effective relief of occasional constipation. thanks. [ phillips' lady ] live the regular life. phillips'. >>> the challenge facing
next, i love the '90s and why boehner and the boys should, too. stay with us. >> several states want to secede from the united states. >> leave the union. >> because 69 results of the election. it's so strange because i had many of those states on a list of states i would like to secede from the united states. i had proposed a bill to the congress. ♪ ♪ [ female announcer ] pop in a whole new kind of clean. with tide pods. a powerful three-in-one detergent that cleans....
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Nov 16, 2012
11/12
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MSNBCW
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i just think about the prospect of john boehner and nancy pelosi working together. i think about you sitting down with vice president biden and president obama and john boehner and talking about what's possible. what do you expect about the republican world view and goals to change because of this election? >> well, the president was very clear in the campaign. on where he stood. there was no ambiguity about where he was on many of the issues. and so his election, i think, strengthens our hand at the table. but the public still has to continue to be engaged. public sentiment is everything. and in the past, for example, the republicans in the house were the odd people out on the -- on some of the tax bill. one of the tax -- you know, deduction. and then also on the transportation bill. and so when the president went public on those, then they finally came around. but they're not going to come around just by persuasion sitting across the table, i do not believe. >> they are not going to come around just by persuasion in washington. nancy pelosi essentially calling for
i just think about the prospect of john boehner and nancy pelosi working together. i think about you sitting down with vice president biden and president obama and john boehner and talking about what's possible. what do you expect about the republican world view and goals to change because of this election? >> well, the president was very clear in the campaign. on where he stood. there was no ambiguity about where he was on many of the issues. and so his election, i think, strengthens our...
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Nov 12, 2012
11/12
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chris: will paul ryan join john boehner, the speaker, in trying to work out a deal? or he will be a rejectionist and set up the big rebel flag and say i'm going to be the die-hard? >> no one knows the answer to that question. that is yet to be seen. paul ryan is in a terrible situation. he can choose to do the right thing or he can decide, you know, he's obviously running for president in 2016, or he can decide to be the holdout and to be the rejectionist. president obama is lucky to have john boehner on the other side that have table because john bainer is not a crazy person. and he can work a deal. right now he simply does not have the votes. but -- again, the president does have to lead here. he has to bring something to the table. he has to be willing to give some that so that john boehner can bring his people to the table, too. but he can deliver. he's been mischaracterized i think. it's convenient for the white house to say, oh, boehner can't get his people behind him. boehner always gets his people behind him but the president has to bring something forward. c
chris: will paul ryan join john boehner, the speaker, in trying to work out a deal? or he will be a rejectionist and set up the big rebel flag and say i'm going to be the die-hard? >> no one knows the answer to that question. that is yet to be seen. paul ryan is in a terrible situation. he can choose to do the right thing or he can decide, you know, he's obviously running for president in 2016, or he can decide to be the holdout and to be the rejectionist. president obama is lucky to have...
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Nov 14, 2012
11/12
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KQED
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boehner is trying to herd them. he felt last time. they're somewhat chastened. they make, with a short-term deal. over the long term, you're right. they will be recalcitrant and feel their principles were not projected and -- were rejected. there will be a long fight and liberals and democrats are kidding themselves if they think otherwise in the flesh of the victory. >> mr. boehner has tried this tack before. what makes you think he will be successful? i hear your point about big business. whether we're talking democratic or republican, what wall street wants, wall street gets much to my chagrin but i digress on that point. what is your sense of how or why this time john boehner will get what he wants but he has not been so successful at keeping his troops in line in the past? >> only because it comes off of some substantial loss. not a landslide loss or defeat but a substantial loss and there is a certain amount of shellshocked. i think also, if we come to the point of whether we're jumping off a cliff or in complete gridlock and we have a party and in that si
boehner is trying to herd them. he felt last time. they're somewhat chastened. they make, with a short-term deal. over the long term, you're right. they will be recalcitrant and feel their principles were not projected and -- were rejected. there will be a long fight and liberals and democrats are kidding themselves if they think otherwise in the flesh of the victory. >> mr. boehner has tried this tack before. what makes you think he will be successful? i hear your point about big...
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Nov 15, 2012
11/12
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john boehner initially said, listen, president, it's time fur to lead. that's what you saw in that press conference, the president saying look at the map, look at my victory and get what and, oh, yeah, guess what, i've won. >> we've officially renamed the fiscal cliff the fiscal curb. it's a little step down and you keep taking the steps so by the time you goat march or april, there's something significant happening but not right away. but there's a tricky thing here. both sides want to call it a cliff because both sides need drama in order to drive the urgency of their position but i'm wondering if at some point the president doesn't soften this as we get into late december and start to say to people, well, on the first week of january, you're going u just going to see a little step. and we will have time to fix it retroactively. >> i think that's probably what you will hear. i think ultimately this is going to be some kind of compromise. the fiscal cliff, it would be about $6 hup billion worth of tax cuts. i think it is going to be softened. there are
john boehner initially said, listen, president, it's time fur to lead. that's what you saw in that press conference, the president saying look at the map, look at my victory and get what and, oh, yeah, guess what, i've won. >> we've officially renamed the fiscal cliff the fiscal curb. it's a little step down and you keep taking the steps so by the time you goat march or april, there's something significant happening but not right away. but there's a tricky thing here. both sides want to...
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Nov 17, 2012
11/12
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CURRENT
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look here we go with more boehner love. i have to show this. this happenedda at the end of the meaning. >> wait, wait, excuse me there is one other point that i want to make and that is my understanding is material is speaker boehner's birthday. for those of you who want to wish hip a happy birthday -- we not not embarrass him with a cake because we didn't know how many candies were needed. >> yeah, right. >> we do want to wish him a happy birthday. >> thank you. thank you. >> all right. thank you, everybody. >> that would be all be nice if he well a tough portion stance -- negotiation stance and he does not and it seems frustrating to people who don't agreey with boehner and don't want to wish him a happy birthday. >> a different situation when reagan and tip o'neill were working together and o'neill would stand up on the president and the president would stand up to tip o'neill and now vuboehner standing up to the president and the president not standing up to boehner. larry cudlow have -- they have been talking about capping deductions to br
look here we go with more boehner love. i have to show this. this happenedda at the end of the meaning. >> wait, wait, excuse me there is one other point that i want to make and that is my understanding is material is speaker boehner's birthday. for those of you who want to wish hip a happy birthday -- we not not embarrass him with a cake because we didn't know how many candies were needed. >> yeah, right. >> we do want to wish him a happy birthday. >> thank you. thank...
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Nov 15, 2012
11/12
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and boehner, speaker john boehner, spoke today and said, wait, just cool your jets. we've got a lot of negotiating to do. they're not going to let that happen. but the stock market may be telling us that the house in checkmate will wind up with a recession from the fiscal cliff. in other words, no deal making means bad recession. is that a scenario -- is that what the market's telling us? >> i think you're dead on. if you look at what's happened, real incomes have fallen much more during the recovery than they did during the preceding recession. 4.8% down versus 2.7% down. unemployment is higher now than when the president first took office. what's made people feel good is a rising stock market. they felt wealthier. now with all these big tax increases coming on on capital gains and dividends, people don't feel that anymore. the significance of this poll, larry, is it's the first poll taken after the election. and the rhetoric has been very strong, also from harry reid. remember, when it looked like romney might win, he said there's going to be in reaching across the
and boehner, speaker john boehner, spoke today and said, wait, just cool your jets. we've got a lot of negotiating to do. they're not going to let that happen. but the stock market may be telling us that the house in checkmate will wind up with a recession from the fiscal cliff. in other words, no deal making means bad recession. is that a scenario -- is that what the market's telling us? >> i think you're dead on. if you look at what's happened, real incomes have fallen much more during...
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Nov 20, 2012
11/12
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what is boehner's intel here? >> because john boehner is smart enough to know he needs to keep paul ryan as close to him as possible. remember, you have paul ryan is part of the young guns. so they caused a little mischief the last time we tried this. this is less about having faith in paul ryan's actual ideas and more about politics. and sort of keeping his close, keeping him engaged, busy doing something so he's not out there making mischief. >> rana, it seems maybe that conservatives are coming to grips with the notion that there may be a tax increase on upper income earners e. i point you to bill crystal saying the unspeakable. let's take a listen. >> there will be a deal by december 31st. i believe republicans will yield on top rates. president obama ran twice and won two elections. he didn't raise rates in 2009. we were in the midst of horrible downturn. they were able to bargain to a deal. i don't think republicans have the lemplg or that it's worth using whatever leverage they have to maintain rates at 35%
what is boehner's intel here? >> because john boehner is smart enough to know he needs to keep paul ryan as close to him as possible. remember, you have paul ryan is part of the young guns. so they caused a little mischief the last time we tried this. this is less about having faith in paul ryan's actual ideas and more about politics. and sort of keeping his close, keeping him engaged, busy doing something so he's not out there making mischief. >> rana, it seems maybe that...
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Nov 12, 2012
11/12
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i think you heard john boehner say that already. we've had votes in the senate where we've actually gotten rid of tax credits. i think that's a given. and i think the vast majority of americans agree with that. the question is how do you do that and how do you allow taxes to rise at the same time you fix the real problem? and the real problem is uncontrolled entitlement spending and a government that has grown massively. not just under this administration, under republican administration. >> let me turn to senator schumer on this point. >> so you have to approach both sides of it. >> let me turn to senator schumer. i'm going to ask you the same question. if the mandate is compromised, what do democrats have to be prepared to accept as a painful outcome in order to achieve compromise? >> well, i agree with you, the mandate is compromise. that's why we have a divided house and senate. and i think if the house stands for anything it's cut government spending, as tom coburn said, and i think we're going to have to do more of it. we hear
i think you heard john boehner say that already. we've had votes in the senate where we've actually gotten rid of tax credits. i think that's a given. and i think the vast majority of americans agree with that. the question is how do you do that and how do you allow taxes to rise at the same time you fix the real problem? and the real problem is uncontrolled entitlement spending and a government that has grown massively. not just under this administration, under republican administration....
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Nov 12, 2012
11/12
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CURRENT
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second, he's rejecting the john boehner approach which is boehner saying i'll agree to revenues as long as they come as a result of economic growth. in other words, we won't legislate changes in taxes. we'll hope that revenues go up. he's saying no, that won't work for me. you're not going to legislate spending cuts. this is the president talking. not legislate revenue changes as well. >> bill: all right. so there are -- the most immediate decision maybe facing the congress is that as you point out, all of the bush tax cuts expire. which means not only the taxes -- tax cuts for the wealthy expire, the tax cuts for those making under $250,000 a year expire as well. so the president said friday all right, the senate has already passed a bill which would give extended tax cutless for the 98%, those making under $250,000. but let the ones for the wealthier people and defined as over $250,000 expire. and he challenged the house of representatives to pass that. what do you think -- so this is a real -- to me, this is like they've got the gun to their head. are you going to pass the tax cut fo
second, he's rejecting the john boehner approach which is boehner saying i'll agree to revenues as long as they come as a result of economic growth. in other words, we won't legislate changes in taxes. we'll hope that revenues go up. he's saying no, that won't work for me. you're not going to legislate spending cuts. this is the president talking. not legislate revenue changes as well. >> bill: all right. so there are -- the most immediate decision maybe facing the congress is that as you...
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negotiate and the republican congress was sort of split between people who wanted to do a deal like boehner and the tea party which were sort of holding him hostage the fact that we wound up in a political position like that is really irresponsible and it's saddening it's not the way that we should be governing that being said if we're going to have some kind of grand bargain it can't be a grand bargain just for the sake of having a bargain and and john boehner coming out yesterday and saying that he wants to put a deal on the table he wants to go back to some kind of big trade between maybe raising some taxes and having long term tax reform is all well and good but i don't think that they're going to be capable of putting together something of that scope and that complexity over just the next couple of weeks particularly when we already have you know in my e-mail box this morning a dozen e-mails from various different special interest groups already saying don't go to a big bargain if you're going to take my you know my my people if it's or you don't go to a big bar and if it means raising
negotiate and the republican congress was sort of split between people who wanted to do a deal like boehner and the tea party which were sort of holding him hostage the fact that we wound up in a political position like that is really irresponsible and it's saddening it's not the way that we should be governing that being said if we're going to have some kind of grand bargain it can't be a grand bargain just for the sake of having a bargain and and john boehner coming out yesterday and saying...
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Nov 13, 2012
11/12
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john boehner wants to find common ground. and even sean hannity is trying to shift to the middle. >> we have to get rid of the immigration issue all together. it's simple. you control the border first. you create a pathway for those that are here. you don't say you have to go home. and that's a position i have evolved on. because you know what, it's got to be resolved. the majority of people here, some have criminal records, you can send them home. but if they are law-abiding, kids are born here, first secure the border, pathway to citizenship, done. whatever little penalties you want to put in there. then it's done. >> pathway to citizenship, done. where was all this talk before the election? you see this is all about getting votes. it's not coming from the heart. reforming immigration policy is a huge risk for the republicans. they could alienate their base. there's no guarantee they will win the latino vote in the long run. let's turn to ruy teixeira. great to have you with us. >> delighted to be here. >> you predicted thi
john boehner wants to find common ground. and even sean hannity is trying to shift to the middle. >> we have to get rid of the immigration issue all together. it's simple. you control the border first. you create a pathway for those that are here. you don't say you have to go home. and that's a position i have evolved on. because you know what, it's got to be resolved. the majority of people here, some have criminal records, you can send them home. but if they are law-abiding, kids are...
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Nov 16, 2012
11/12
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i want to say, tamron, that it was house speaker john boehner's birthday. president obama gave him a bottle of wine. >> kristen, you spoimed it. we were going to show that later. rats. really, kristen welker? >> caller: so, sorry. >> i have something else to ask you about. i'm just giving you grief. the civic meeting is taking place, the reverend al, the national action network, and he's meeting with civic leaders. is he prepares some on the letter r left for concessions or things they may not like that comes out of these negotiations? >> reporter: well, i think it's both. i think it's that he's trying to prepare some on the left for concessions. he's trying to build up really his strength to be able to put pressure on republicans to come to the table with him over taxes. president obama meeting with with union leaders early this week, also business leaders, so he's really trying to form a broad consensus, i think, to put pressure on republicans and democrats to get something done, to actually get something accomplished before that january 1st deadline. tam
i want to say, tamron, that it was house speaker john boehner's birthday. president obama gave him a bottle of wine. >> kristen, you spoimed it. we were going to show that later. rats. really, kristen welker? >> caller: so, sorry. >> i have something else to ask you about. i'm just giving you grief. the civic meeting is taking place, the reverend al, the national action network, and he's meeting with civic leaders. is he prepares some on the letter r left for concessions or...
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Nov 12, 2012
11/12
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can boehner think, look, i've got as much mandate as the president? >> i think he should absolutely think that, paul. the president made clear, didn't really run on the second term agenda and didn't talk about it much. i'll tell you what the mandate is right now, the mandate is that fiscal cliff, the bipartisan mandate. >> paul: to go off it is the mandate or not to go off. >> i think the stock market went off in the last week, people are saying pretty clearly you've got to do something about this now. i think they have a lot of leverage here, because if something isn't done, the economy is going to decline, maybe go into recession and i think employment can get as high as 10%. >> paul: if we had another recession it would have. >> if you're the president of the united states in a second term, you do not want a legacy, unemployment-- >> the lesson, don't give in at all, you won and if you go off a cliff, you blame them and they'll get the blame. >> he has no other term. i think obama's going to start thinking about his legacy and i predict he may thro
can boehner think, look, i've got as much mandate as the president? >> i think he should absolutely think that, paul. the president made clear, didn't really run on the second term agenda and didn't talk about it much. i'll tell you what the mandate is right now, the mandate is that fiscal cliff, the bipartisan mandate. >> paul: to go off it is the mandate or not to go off. >> i think the stock market went off in the last week, people are saying pretty clearly you've got to do...
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Nov 12, 2012
11/12
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how much does boehner speak for his conference, by the way? how much leeway does he have to cut a deal that might anger some conservatives? this weekend there were signs of softening among conservatives on the issue of taxes. here is "the weekly standard questions bill kristol sunday. >> it won't kill the country if we raise tax as little bit on millionaires. i don't understand why republicans don't take obama's offer to freeze taxes for everyone below $250,000, make it a million. the republican party is going to defend a bunch of millionaires, half who voted democratic and hatch live in hollywood. >> although tom price who is running to lead the house republican conference said sunday he is open to closing some tax loopholes, he did buck boehner on the issue of health care. >> question, do most house republicans, do you agree with speaker boehner that repeal of obama care with this election, with his re-election, is debt? >> we're not opposed to the president's health care law because of the election. we're opposed because it's bad policy and
how much does boehner speak for his conference, by the way? how much leeway does he have to cut a deal that might anger some conservatives? this weekend there were signs of softening among conservatives on the issue of taxes. here is "the weekly standard questions bill kristol sunday. >> it won't kill the country if we raise tax as little bit on millionaires. i don't understand why republicans don't take obama's offer to freeze taxes for everyone below $250,000, make it a million....
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Nov 17, 2012
11/12
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boehner. is it any different, or is this just about, i don't know, smoke and mirrors? >> well, i think the atmosphere is certainly different as you mentioned. in the past, these guys would go back to capitol hill and put out competing statements about what went on during the meetings. you saw what happened last year during the debt ceiling negotiations. this time it was one big happy family. there certainly seems to be some sort of recognition on the part of how fed up american people with sort of the seeing this game of chicken being played at such a high stakes time. i think there is certainly, after this election, there is kind of a let's get down to business. let's see if we can get this thing done. whether that can translate -- david just said, the biggest sticking point, taxes on the wealthy is still on the table. you can sing happy birthday to john boehner as much as you want. gwen: he would still say no. >> absolutely. i think it's really premature to try to predict what is going to ha
boehner. is it any different, or is this just about, i don't know, smoke and mirrors? >> well, i think the atmosphere is certainly different as you mentioned. in the past, these guys would go back to capitol hill and put out competing statements about what went on during the meetings. you saw what happened last year during the debt ceiling negotiations. this time it was one big happy family. there certainly seems to be some sort of recognition on the part of how fed up american people...
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Nov 17, 2012
11/12
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. >> is speaker boehner ready to make a deal? >> the president convened a pow wow with leaders. >> the congressional leaders meeting at the white house today. >> begin negotiations about how to avoid that so-called fiscal cliff. >> fiscal cliff. >> this is the beginning of a fruitful process. >> the issue is taxes. >> only one bad word -- taxes. >> raising taxes is a very bad idea. >> raising taxes is a terrible idea. >> to show our seriousness, we put revenue on the table. >> we're prepared to put revenue on the table. >> a deadline. >> being able to work something out. >> there was a spirit of cooperation. >> tomorrow is speaker boehner's birthday. we didn't know how many candles were needed. ♪ best friend ♪ >> interrupting that was the ghost of christmas past. >> you guys are the best. thank you so much. >> mitt, 47%, romney. he is the gift that keeps on giving. >> republicans did not take kindly to mr. romney's words. >> i don't agree with the comments. >> we lost the presidency. it's time to move on. >> general petraeus
. >> is speaker boehner ready to make a deal? >> the president convened a pow wow with leaders. >> the congressional leaders meeting at the white house today. >> begin negotiations about how to avoid that so-called fiscal cliff. >> fiscal cliff. >> this is the beginning of a fruitful process. >> the issue is taxes. >> only one bad word -- taxes. >> raising taxes is a very bad idea. >> raising taxes is a terrible idea. >> to show...
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Nov 13, 2012
11/12
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speaker boehner, topless or otherwise. joy reid, david corn, and bill cohen, thank you all. apologies to david for that offensive anal si. >>> coming up, congress is back, the fiscal cliff is near. will house republicans finally think of the good of the country and not the good of this guy? >> the president was committed -- elected on the basis that he was not romney and that romney was a poopy head and you should vote against romney. [ female announcer ] so how long have you been living flake-free with head & shoulders? since before jeans were this skinny... since us three got a haircut. since my first twenty-ninth birthday. [ female announcer ] head & shoulders. live flake free. without freshly-made pasta. you could also cut corners by making it without 100% real cheddar cheese. but then...it wouldn't be stouffer's mac & cheese. just one of over 70 satisfying recipes for one from stouffer's. >>> well, count grover norquist among the walking wounded after last week's election because a new report says the man responsible for the infamous anti-tax pledge doesn't have the sam
speaker boehner, topless or otherwise. joy reid, david corn, and bill cohen, thank you all. apologies to david for that offensive anal si. >>> coming up, congress is back, the fiscal cliff is near. will house republicans finally think of the good of the country and not the good of this guy? >> the president was committed -- elected on the basis that he was not romney and that romney was a poopy head and you should vote against romney. [ female announcer ] so how long have you...